Narrowed it down, but a little more help would be great

C

corrosionate

Member
#1
#1
So I got this for $100 yesterday. The Girlfriend actually found it, negotiated the price, and picked it up for me. All I had to do was send the cash with her. I love that woman. Kinda makes up for how mean she can be sometimes ;-)

Anyway, here's what I know:
-it looks like a Gilson, Montgomery Wards, or Allis Chalmers
-single speed jack shaft and no rear shocks, so probably would have had a 4hp engine judging by the options I've seen

But here's what confuses me:
-the shape of the stickers on the fork, and chain guard (painted over) doesnt match the size/shape of the stickers I see on the Gilson/Ward/Allis Chalmers bikes in photos.

So my questions I'm hoping for help with:
-does anyone know if these bikes were rebranded with any other names besides Gilson, Ward, or Allis Chalmers?
-any thoughts on how I can safely remove the paint from the stickers without damaging the stickers so I can see what they say on them?
-I believe the Serial number plate is still intact, just painted over. anyone know if/how I can decode the serial number to get a year and model? May depend on the make/brand I guess....

Ill post more photos tonight, with close-ups of the stickers. They're much smaller that the stickers I see in photos of the aforementioned bikes. You can just see the size/shape, not any of the printing on them :-/

Any help is appreciated!

 
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J

JKautoFab

Active Member
#2
#2
are you sure someone didnt replace the rear shocks with those solid pieces? i dont know enough about these bikes to know, but looks like you just need a couple shocks to be fully suspended!
 
minibikin'

minibikin'

Sho-nuff
#3
#3
The lower model Gilson and Wards would have had the rear struts such as a model 424. I've never seen them branded as anything else. It's 40+ years old so the decals may not be original.
 
capguncowboy

capguncowboy

Well-Known Member
#5
#5
Yes, it's a Gilson made bike. Some of the lower models had struts, like on your bike, and some of them had Sebac shocks. These were also sold as Montgomery Ward bikes.

It looks like your bike has the clutch guard, and the rear chain guard. The wheels look correct too. The only thing that's not original is that Honda engine and the seat.

You did great for $100!

Gilson bikes are among the best riders out there. They're really heavy, but the ride is extremely smooth, even in rough terrain.

EDIT: It looks like someone strapped the rear fender to the underside of the frame. It should be strapped to the holes on the swingarm behind the struts. On a suspended bike, this would prevent the wheel from scrubbing the fender if you bottomed out. That's an easy fix though

To remove the paint, try a gentle remover like Goof Off, and lots of elbow grease. I agree that the chance the decals under the paint are original are slim, but anything is possible. Yes, it would have had an HS40 originally, and as far as I know, there is no way to distinguish between the years. The model number will be on your ID tag though. Just clear it with some Goof Off.
 
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C

corrosionate

Member
#6
#6
Yeah, the rear fender is strapped wrong, I noticed that too. I'll fix that. Other than the cracked fenders, high speed fork, and the engine having been swapped, the bike is very complete and in great shape. No slop in the head, or jackshaft or anything. I think the rear wheel may have been changed out to a solid wheel, but I'll confirm that later.

They have the chain out of alignment from clutch to jackshaft cus apparently the clutch wouldn't fit behind the guard properly with the sprocket to the inside, and they obviously didn't want the engine hanging all the way out the right side. Ill deal with that as well. Probably with a custom chain guard, but I'll see what's up when I get more time to eyeball stuff. I'll likely try this 4hp engine on my Manco Pathfinder I'm building for my kid, and put the 212 predator on this Gilson for me to ride. Maybe a TAV even...

I will slap some shocks on the back for sure. That's the only complaint I have with my DB, stiff ride when off road that hurts my back.

Thanks for the info fellas! I'll try to see what those stickers say for curiosity's sake.

Thanks!
 
C

corrosionate

Member
#7
#7
Ok, in case anyone was curious, here are the stickers I uncovered. Clearly not original. They appear to have been peeled off of some farm/excavation equipment and stuck on there.

The good news is, I got a better view at the serial number plate after removing a layer of paint. Searching gil-13976a turns up results that have me believing it to be a Montgomery Wards 424. Good enough for me. I was just super curious, so that when folks ask me what it is, I can say it with confidence, and not necessarily have to give the story of how it's a Gilson/wards/AC, unless I want to.

Thanks again all!
 
C

corrosionate

Member
#9
#9
I like it :). Is that a 6.5hp? I reckon I'll be putting a predator 212 on mine. Not decided on clutch or TAV yet. I've not ever really run one with a clutch but I may try one first.
 
C

corrosionate

Member
#10
#10
Ok, I know it's an old thread, but I've been too busy with babies and stuff to do the things I once enjoyed, so I haven't touched the bike since ahortly after my last post.

Today I noticed some raised emblems on the bike. One on the fork plate and one on the clutch cover. I scraped them off with a razor blade and found this


I thought I was onto something, but was unable to find a mini bike brand with that logo. After a little searching though,, I found this


So that explains the weird stickers on the bike. They were taken from some piece of Ditch Witch equipment. Lol

Doesn't help with much other than solving a small mystery. :)
 
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