First Minibike, from scratch.

#1
Hi, I think this is my first post in the forum.

I am making a minibike from scratch, it is one of the things i wanted to do since i was a little kid, and now with better skills, some experience and some money, the idea came back.

I started like four months ago, but for money reasons, i had stop the project for like three months. Now with some money in my pocket, and a Bike meeting in my town in the next week, I want to finish it.


This is what i got so far, it's not so much. There was like 20 hours inverted, along various days (i could not use my dad's workshop too much because there are people working there all day, i have to work at dawn most the time).
So, here are the pics (they are out of date, i had sell my only camera):







The motor is a Two-Stroke Zanella (National brand) from my old moped, 70cc, 6000~7000rpm, tiny but very powerful, The moped developed like 80Km/h with that. (Another project, a three-wheeler with a same motor, but teaked, developed 105Km/h :scared: )
The carburator is a Dellorto 12-14 with a 65cal chicleur.


I am now doing the "thing" that holds the motor to the frame.

Something i cannot figure out, is how the heck I would stop the thing. At first I had the idea of using a disc brake, but i now realize that the disc would fits, the caliper wouldn't.
A drum brake would never, in the great history of earth, fit inside that little wheel, at least not one that i can find in a store here, i would have to do it, but then finding brake shoes for that diameter would be impossible for me.

The only thing that seems doable for me, is, using a transmission in two steps, like this bike http://img529.imageshack.us/img529/8949/img4438p.jpg
And using a disc brake in the transmission. But then i would stress too much the chain, do I?


PS: This are the wheels i'am using (26cm diameter, like 10 inches)




And the shock absorbers:





Well, I think that's all for now. Suggestions and critics are, off course, welcome.



Note: Sorry for my bad english, it isn't my native language, I'm from Argentina.
 
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#2
:lol: Your english is fine. You did a great job with your first post.. :thumbsup: As for your bike, they have wat is called a ban brake that you could use.. If it is hard for you to aquire parts, a band brake would be a simple part to make. It is a band of absorbant material that wraps around a drum, then clamps down as you draw the band tight around the drum.. You could get one of those or even make your own on the rear wheel hub.. Your bike looks good so far. :thumbsup:
 

Tomas

New Member
#3
Cool build idea.The wheels wouldn't be my first choice though I would advise an actual set of mini bike wheels that would help take care of your brake problem.By the way you have a kool Name.:thumbsup:
 
#4
Thanks Tomas! (That's my original name, by the way!). I just used the most cheap wheels i could find :p
My budget is very low, right now i have like 60 dollars to spend.

:lol: Your english is fine. You did a great job with your first post.. :thumbsup: As for your bike, they have wat is called a ban brake that you could use.. If it is hard for you to aquire parts, a band brake would be a simple part to make. It is a band of absorbant material that wraps around a drum, then clamps down as you draw the band tight around the drum.. You could get one of those or even make your own on the rear wheel hub.. Your bike looks good so far. :thumbsup:
I had considered the band brake (had used it before in a go-kart), but a band brake that could fit inside the tiny space of the wheel, would have a low diameter, thus giving me too little friction. I think (if my brain doesn't fail), that the friction it's exponential as the diameter increases.

I will post followups as long as the project goes. Maybe the sunday i can continue.
 

delray

Well-Known Member
#5
Tomasito, highly recommended not to use them rims you purchase. they are only made for very low speeds. if you really have no other ways of purchasing better rims? then try to weld around the hub to the flange and pop out the low speed bearings and install a set of high speed bearing. you should be able to purchase good bearings for around $3 or so. there is a very good chance at high speeds the cheap bearings could blow out. it's always cool to see home built stuff,but safety really comes first and from the looks of that motor,that baby is going to fly...
 

SpyGuy

New Member
#6
I'd go with the mini bike wheels, too ... be a lot easier to set up the braking system, although you could also use a scrub brake. (Scrub brakes are just steel plates that rub against the tire. I wouldn't do them, as it wears out the tire too fast.) I've also used goped wheels for a home-built bike.
 
#7
I hate to be a downer, but those wheels will come apart during the first ride...

The metal is paper-thin, and the flange is only crimped to the hub...

We put a pair on the front of a kart just to see how long they'd last...it was less than a minute.
 
#9
Well, the wheels are rated 500Kg each (and i have used them with like 300Kg without problem, at low speeds), and the bearings in them are SKF 6204, rated at 20.000 RPM Max.

I know these are not the ideal wheels, but here, minibikes parts doesn't even exist, nor wheels for them. So i'll have to use that. I will reinforce the rims though.
The smallest suitable wheels i could find, are moped's 14 inch, wich is way too much. (See THIS photo)

One thing i'll do too, is to limit the motor (maybe use a smaller carburator and limit the accelerator). The whole thing could easily reach 100Km/h (+/- 62Mph). I want to get fun, not get fired to the air at that speed and die. :biggrin:

The metal, i think, is at least 1/16'', but i haven't measured. The flange, i'm pretty sure, is welded to the hub. But as I said, I'll reinforce as much as I can.

I don't want to defend too much my wheels, but hell, they are the only thing I can use :sadcrying4:


Tomorrow, when i go to the workshop to keep working, I will check them well and take some measures to the wheels.

As for the brake, I have come with and idea. I could attach a centrifugal clutch bell to the wheel, and the other part, make it manual, and attach it to the frame. I think it could work as some sort of drum brake, and those clutches are pretty cheap. Pics HERE, and HERE.



PS: Don't I have to create a separate thread to discuss these technical issues, or we can keep discussing them in this thread?
 

delray

Well-Known Member
#11
if the technical issues are about your build ? keep it here:smile:
you may want to grind real lite around your hubs or sand blast the zinc plating of first. it will make it much easyer to weld the flange and the hub together:smile:
 
#12
Yeah, zinced iron is really, really nasty to weld on. Learned it the hard way :doah:
Welding is an art, and you never stop learning about it.
A trick for welding very thin sheet metal, is to put a copper bar (it MUST be copper, although aluminum might work, never tried) in the back of the sheet you are welding on. You will never make a hole with that method! :wink:


Good to see mini biking in Argentina. :thumbsup:
Thanks! Though it's a hard task. Like I said, minibikes are almost inexistent here, nor parts for them. So you have to do everything by hand, or adapt/modify parts all the time. I knew before I start that was going to be hard, but that's why it's fun, doesn't it? :wink:
 
#13
looks like its gonna be a sweet bike. I used those wheels on one of my minis and theyre not broken yet. I did change the bearings though because they blew out. Also im using different tires but those should last a while. I welded a sprocket on but no brakes yet. You should look at copying the swingarm design of a rupp continental. Simple and effective
 
#14
well, I'll tell ya what Tomasito... EVERYbody has chimed in on the wheels.. I originally didn't want to break your spirits because I (originally asumed) you are stuck with next to nothing to use for parts. :sadcrying4: But man... Those wheels will never ever handle the speeds you are talking about.. Just smooth driving is too much for them. I have used the larger version of the same wheel before and they are awful. They are not even capable of what the manufacturer (claims) they are.. The tire itself is just junk and everything about them is junk....:hammer:

NOW....... with THAT being said... I have a VERY VERY nice set of OLD wheels built probably in the 1960's. They were originally designed as the same type of thing you have. Sort of a dolly or hand cart wheel.. Only they are MUCH MUCH MUCH better than the 4 inch Chinese ones you have now. About 1,000 times better.. They are 6 inch wheels with tires, They are a very solid steel split rim with GOOD bearings in them and have a very nice saw tooth type tread pattern.. They were never originally on a mini bike BUT would WORK VERY WELL!!! Thats why I got them and saved them.. I recently thought of listing the wheels for sale here for like 25 dollars for the set so someone might use them.....

IF you would like... I could look into shipping them to you and I would sell them for practically nothing, just because I would like to see them go to a good place, and from the looks of things, I can not imagine a better place for them.. :thumbsup: Please don't try to go 60 miles per hour on those Chinese 4 inch plastic tires. :hang: :sadcrying4:
 

Neck

Growing up is optional
#15
It looks like your off to a great start! the work you have done is very good. I agree with everyone else on the wheel issue. I was wondering, how will the engine be started without the pedals? How else can we help you?
 
#17
NOW....... with THAT being said... I have a VERY VERY nice set of OLD wheels built probably in the 1960's. They were originally designed as the same type of thing you have. Sort of a dolly or hand cart wheel.. Only they are MUCH MUCH MUCH better than the 4 inch Chinese ones you have now. About 1,000 times better.. They are 6 inch wheels with tires, They are a very solid steel split rim with GOOD bearings in them and have a very nice saw tooth type tread pattern.. They were never originally on a mini bike BUT would WORK VERY WELL!!! Thats why I got them and saved them.. I recently thought of listing the wheels for sale here for like 25 dollars for the set so someone might use them.....

IF you would like... I could look into shipping them to you and I would sell them for practically nothing, just because I would like to see them go to a good place, and from the looks of things, I can not imagine a better place for them.. :thumbsup: Please don't try to go 60 miles per hour on those Chinese 4 inch plastic tires. :hang: :sadcrying4:
Thanks! I have looked at USPS web, and if the wheels wheigt more o less 10 pounds, it will cost arround 50/60 bucks to ship. It isn't that much, considering that today i went to a bike shop, and asked for minibike wheels. The guy looked at me like if I was asking for airplane's wheels or something. The only thing that he could get me he said, are mini-quad wheels, same size than mines, and they cost arround 60 bucks EACH.
Maybe I could consider buying yours, depending of the price, they'll cost me less :smile:

...I was wondering, how will the engine be started without the pedals?...
For the photos you can't tell, but the motor has a kick :tongue:

The frame looks great...are you going to make a swingarm?
Yup, It is what I'm making right now. By the way, the frame was the easiest part of the bike (who could know that?). The small things are the ones wich make you think, think and think, and cost you a lot of time. :sadcrying4:



Well, I am right now at the workshop. The engine is now ¿monted?. I'm now making the swingarm, wich i'm figuring out how to mount to the frame :1orglaugh:

Things made so far:
-Frame
-Front fork
-Engine mount
-Crappy seat (I had it already, will change later, for now it's ok).

Things to do:
-Swingarm (in process)
-Oil thank
-Handle bar (I think i have one somewhere wich could work)
-Brakes
-Get some decent wheels!
-Quit smoking :no:



I have to get this thing at least running in three days (counting today) for the bike meeting!
Time it's clooking!
 
#18
OK, I will look into that for ya.. They are sorta heavy.. Not real bad.. I've done a lot of shipping. I know prices are outrageous lately and it may be ridiculous, but we'll what happens..
 
#20
:scared: THAT much? My god..

85$ shipping plus 25 each wheel is WAY above my budget :frown: :frown:
Are you sure that is the cost for the shipping? Check here: USPS - Priority Mail International Prices
I think that is the cheapest shipment. (My country is the #9 in the list)
How much do they weight?

I just come back from ALL the hardware stores in town, and i could not find anything better :sadcrying4:


I keep doing the swingarm, stoped a while for lunch. I've burned my left hand like a hundread times with tiny hot flying metal pieces from the lathe :doah:
 
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