Times Two B200R

I R Me Can Nix 2

I R Me Can Nix 2

Member
#1
#1
WARNING: New Member...
Please lower your growls. So this B200r sale at Trakter Sup-lies got me. I was in search of something to tinker with besides the bucket list.

After 3 laps around the yard, my wife ordered her's for pickup. Me being an old AMA Honda sponsored motorcrosser, this was very exciting, as you can imagine.

These will remain governed. I have purchased two 30 series CVTs and went far enough to find the engine needs raised. DOH! Of course it does... EVERYONE knows that!
Pulled the trigger on two generic riser plates claiming 1.7 ish inch rise. (You know the one.) Then slide off the couch and measured the air gap between the top of the air filter and frame. DOH! Spacial relations are fuzzy up here too.
Looking at filter adapters and headers and I thought... Man, I bet those awesome folks over here have crossed this bridge and would LOVE to see me try. For entertainment purposes.

What are these for you ask?
These will be worry free, slow speed torque monster trail bikes, used as a couple. Top speed is of no concern as long as the lawn mower doesn't pass it.
However... wifey doesn't need me yelling about clutch lock up and governor bounce back, while she learns her first 2 wheeler in the woods. These have about 35 mins and an oil change with magnetic drain plugs, on them.
Choppy non confidence building throttle with clutch snap will not help her stay interested either.
Enter CVT install...

I am guessing it will take approximately 1 1/4 inches of lift to clear the CVT without modifying the CVT. (Which I may to save space)
I see the square tubing shoved under some engines. But... I fear a structural loss to the block. Not being flat mounted. (I will ride the poo out of this bike, accidentally.) "HE IS insulting to any decent peice of equipment." To quote my old crew cheif/loving uncle.
Has anyone broken mounting ears off these 196cc copies?

I am interested in getting these CVTs on before I go rejetting and making them loud as there is seat time needed before all of that. But I should order parts now... right? RIGHT!

So please... tell me the square tubing mounts are bad. Then I will do it right.

Here is proof.

20231118_104347.png
 
Charles S

Charles S

#2
#2
Hello and welcome! I would do the CVT plate mod. Slotting the holes and grinding down one gusset will allow the plate to be rotated, raising the driven somewhere in the 1-1.5" range if done correctly. The PTO needs to remain centered in the plate's opening to maintain the proper distance between the driver and driven so all four bolt holes should be slotted (or drilled between). Once you hold a CVT plate against the engine, you will see which holes need to be slotted and which gusset on the backside needs to be cut/ground down. The bottom of the CVT plate, adjacent to the driven, can be trimmed to clear the lower frame tube if needed. Doing this eliminates the need to raise the engine on some bikes, reducing the engine raising needed on others and, as a bonus, looks much better with the driven raised.

https://oldminibikes.com/forum/inde...ith-predator-212-and-torque-converter.103977/

https://oldminibikes.com/forum/index.php?threads/want-to-put-a-tc-on-a-coleman-ct100.141989/
That is a smaller 98cc clone so the PTO is closer to the base than a 196/212 would be.
 
I R Me Can Nix 2

I R Me Can Nix 2

Member
#3
#3
Thanks Charles, for the links!
I will do the slotting or redrilling, and gusset notching, as any extra clearance that can be gained is welcome. My nickname long ago, was once Uncle Gusset.
I am only home on the weekends, but I always take a few hours for tinkering on Friday evenings and Saturdays. Keeps me sane. Besides the fact that I overload my tasks.

I did quickly pull it down and held the backing plate up to it. And then reassembled it as to not leave wifey without an equal riding partner. I saw the gusset interference with the cylinder. This all makes perfect sense, thanks.

I will take photos and report back as I do these bikes. I know it has obviously been done before, but why not share the struggle anyway. For craps and cramps!

Does the rectifier's body need ground?
 
I R Me Can Nix 2

I R Me Can Nix 2

Member
#4
#4
20231103_144550.jpg
Might hide them here. I need to make a mount if the body has to be grounded. The dirt biker in me wants to raise all electronics and delete connectors.
I made 2 simple plastic rock deflectors and put them on the frame down tube fronts. The exposed engine case behind the front wheel made me cringe. I do not have a picture of that yet.
 
SAS289

SAS289

Well-Known Member
#6
#6
I R Me Can Nix 2 said:
View attachment 308393
Might hide them here. I need to make a mount if the body has to be grounded. The dirt biker in me wants to raise all electronics and delete connectors.
I made 2 simple plastic rock deflectors and put them on the frame down tube fronts. The exposed engine case behind the front wheel made me cringe. I do not have a picture of that yet.
Click to expand...
I don't like how splash shields look but they work. I did the back on one of my bikes. 20210705_115906.jpg 20210705_115959.jpg 20210705_115906.jpg 20210705_115959.jpg
 
SAS289

SAS289

Well-Known Member
#7
#7
You could run any kind of engine riser. Look at the pictures I posted. I ran that plastic sandwich for three years without a problem. I changed them out this year with an engine riser that has left /right adjustability on both of my bikes.

That's nothing compared to what others have used to raise their engine an inch.
 
I R Me Can Nix 2

I R Me Can Nix 2

Member
#8
#8
I haven't done the rear. The front splash shields look exactly like yours, except they extend up an inch or two higher.

I was concerned about the block mounting ears being brittle. I guess we aren't making enough power to worry yet.

Thanks for replying!
 
TheMattHouston

TheMattHouston

New Member
#9
#9
1000001007.jpg

I just got 2 at Tractor supply as well. I got them for my 14 yo and myself to tinker on. I will be following this post. I am starting with a torque converter with stock air box and exhaust and am trying to figure out Fitment as well. Thanks for the assistance on the other thread.
 
I R Me Can Nix 2

I R Me Can Nix 2

Member
#11
#11
Same here Houston. Just gathering the parts up to start modifications. So I do not have answers, yet.
There is another thread on a rb200 which shares frame part numbers with our bikes.
Guy claims 1 1/4 inches engine lift is good.
This Saturday I plan to try the up and forward 1.7 inch generic mount, as I too want to keep the stock muffler for now.
I will report back if or what happens.
And you are welcome, no worries... all play!
 
I R Me Can Nix 2

I R Me Can Nix 2

Member
#14
#14
Things came up. So, I didn't get any time to poke around and test fit anything. This comming weekend should be better, though.

I did notice that the left side footpeg will be getting shorter with the addition of a CVT. (It is already shorter than the right side, if you noticed on your bike.) I already expect to redrill the engine riser to center everything back up. May need to do some spacer work with the drive sprocket and drive/driven pulleys.

I will first test fit to see if there is enough height to NOT have to modify the CVT backing plate.
Then how much interference there is with the factory exhaust and air filter. Once this is solved I will center everything up a little better and look at sprocket drive alignment before, during and after. I prefer to not modify the chassis but instead modify my parts or add-on's, keeps returning to stock an option.

More to come...
 
J

JimN

#19
#19
Hi, hope you don't mind me throwing in my 2 cents. Do your bikes come stock with a 50 tooth rear sprocket that you plan to change? According to Coleman specs your bike is going to weigh in at around 160ish wet weight. Even with a cvt I don't think that is going to give you the torque monster you want, depending on your weight. No insult intended.
My home build porks in around 180 and with me on it total weight is around 360. I started my build with a cvt and 10/60 tooth sprockets. I've been lowering the gearing since then. With about 10 hours total riding time and right before I tore it down to finish painting I was using 9/72 sprockets for 8:1 with the driven spring in the torque hole. When I put it back together I'm going to put the 8t sprocket on for 9:1 ratio.
That is with 19" tires. You may already know this but when you switched to 21" tires you effectively raised your existing gear ratio compared to the 19's.
If you have already taken this into consideration, my bad.
 
SAS289

SAS289

Well-Known Member
#20
#20
JimN said:
Hi, hope you don't mind me throwing in my 2 cents. Do your bikes come stock with a 50 tooth rear sprocket that you plan to change? According to Coleman specs your bike is going to weigh in at around 160ish wet weight. Even with a cvt I don't think that is going to give you the torque monster you want, depending on your weight. No insult intended.
My home build porks in around 180 and with me on it total weight is around 360. I started my build with a cvt and 10/60 tooth sprockets. I've been lowering the gearing since then. With about 10 hours total riding time and right before I tore it down to finish painting I was using 9/72 sprockets for 8:1 with the driven spring in the torque hole. When I put it back together I'm going to put the 8t sprocket on for 9:1 ratio.
That is with 19" tires. You may already know this but when you switched to 21" tires you effectively raised your existing gear ratio compared to the 19's.
If you have already taken this into consideration, my bad.
Click to expand...
Was at a Tractor Supply yesterday looking at these and thought they looked heavy. But 160? With empty tanks my 200U's weigh around 115-120.

These guys are just starting the upgrade progression. But gearing talk is important with these tall tire bikes.
 
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